Comments on: How about we design Birmingham with a WIKI?

By: Joanna Geary

Joanna Geary — Mon, 12 Nov 2007 14:03:05 +0000

I don’t see any reason why a particularly contentious area couldn’t have a link saying “this issue is attracting debate - please click here to see all views”.

Then you could have a for and against section perhaps?

By: stef

stef — Fri, 09 Nov 2007 23:05:45 +0000

@Dubber - now that’s a very good point. And I was thinking that perhaps “WIKI” is only one part of the process. Destructive edits or opposing entries for the same content would happen in this situation because we are talking about the ‘future’, so it’s all purely opinion-based rather than factual.

Perhaps we need to make a new type of system.

Something WIKI-like but that takes into account these special circumstances.

A new invention for a specific purpose sounds Birmingham-like too.

By: Dubber

Dubber — Fri, 09 Nov 2007 19:30:56 +0000

It’s worth mentioning that in Wikis, editing does not just mean adding things to the document, but also taking things away from it.

There are, let’s not forget, competing positions on certain matters (eg Heritage buildings) that you can consult all you like on — but at some point someone has to make an unpopular decision because consensus is so unlikely.

With a wiki, you’d get into a situation where there is an infintely iterating repost-and-delete of certain matters — because unlike in Wikipedia, matters of opinion are being included, rather than just demonstrable matters of fact.

In the game of Go, this infinite iteration problem is known as Ko - an illegal sequence of moves that bring the game to a halt, so perhaps we could take a leaf out of that game’s rulebook and set it up so that such a move is impossible.

Instead, rather than delete an oppositional viewpoint, alternative positions can be set alongside each other with something that indicates that there is difference of opinion on the matter, and that these views represent the differing stances.

If that bit can be sorted, the wiki idea is marvellous.

By: Joanna Geary

Joanna Geary — Thu, 08 Nov 2007 12:49:54 +0000

Tom: Putting it on the wifi is a great idea! It’s a resource that is already up and running - it makes perfect sense!

I am also interested in who would be able to access the wiki. Would it be open to everyone? If so, will there be a moderation/approval system to clean up any abuse? (I can imagine wiki kiosks in town attracting some very alternative edits on a Saturday night!)

By: Hannah

Hannah — Thu, 08 Nov 2007 12:14:40 +0000

WIKIBRUM - genius. I am a member of several organisations in the city; Jewellery Quarter Association, Birmingham Future, Allotments Association (!) and all complain of a lack of forum for their voices to be heard. This is a modern, accessible, democratic solution - am all for it. By the way, there were eight females invited to the city team seminar, though I can recall maybe six attended? Twenty five males were invited (from the list I received).

By: Tom

Tom — Thu, 08 Nov 2007 08:03:58 +0000

Very interesting, I love the idea. Will everyone get access to edit it? How far will this influence the actual planning?

If the wiki gets setup you should try and get it on the free city centre wifi. Some sort of education/ involvement though kiosks or internet cafe is definitely needed.

By: stef

stef — Thu, 08 Nov 2007 03:23:26 +0000

@Joanna - We heard at the conference that where this idea was used in New Zealand that (citation needed here) that they used some specially constructed public kiosks where people could go and make edits for exactly that reason. Not sure if that would be within the remit/scope of what’s being planned here but there must be interesting ways of doing this…

By: Podnosh Blog : High Fibre Podcasting » Archive » Highbury 2.0

Podnosh Blog : High Fibre Podcasting » Archive » Highbury 2.0 — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 23:29:21 +0000

[...] the ring road down it is 2007 and Stef Lewandowski is now proposing a crowdsourced future for the city centre, using us and a wiki to shape where next. Highbury 2.0 has my support, how [...]

By: stef

stef — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 23:06:23 +0000

@Jan - I guess the subtle irony didn’t get through the web text filter… I’m not seriously suggesting that this be called a mistressplan, just pointing to Sandra’s reaction on exactly those connotations!

By: Joanna Geary

Joanna Geary — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 18:20:37 +0000

WIKIBrum! I love it!

The potential this has really excites me - a WIKI is such a great way to open up this process to everyone and anyone who cares about the city.

Rather than have a few influential bods in the council choosing a small group who might come up with good ideas, a WIKI means that those who shape the city of the future are self-selecting. If they are enthusiastic enough they will come and edit (as long as it is well publicised).

If BCC really support it, surely it would be a UK (if not world) first?! It would also send out some very positive vibes that Birmingham is progressive, collaborative and knows how to use technology to good effect.

One thought: Would people put their postcodes and ages into the site when they log in? A WIKI would be well publicised amongst the webfolk, many of whom live Moseley/KH/Harbourne/Bearwood and I assume, most come from a certain age bracket.

It would be nice to get it out to other areas and ages too, although I’m not sure how you would do that. A dedicated WIKIBrum computer in local libraries perhaps?